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Horse De-Wormer OD's are filling up Hospitals
This thread has 124 replies. Displaying posts 1 through 15.
Post 1 made on Saturday September 4, 2021 at 00:29
davidcasemore
Super Member
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Really, people. Some of you really believe some stupid sh!t. Hospitals (mostly in red states) are filling their ICUs with mostly unvaccinated fools. And not just the "unhealthy and old". Young people are being hospitalized, too.

What is it going to take to get (some of) you to return to planet Earth and stop this nonsense? Don't you want this to be over so we can go back to the good old days?

Getting vaccinated, wearing a mask, and social distancing are patriotic things to do. What the f*ck is so terrible about putting on a mask? Are you that fragile? This is where libertarianism goes off the deep end.

And stop with the endless links to articles with discredited horse-nonsense. If I sent you a link to a magic crystal (only $6,000) which, if you set it on top of your AVR, would increase the frequency response and lower the distortion, would you buy one?
Fins: Still Slamming' His Trunk on pilgrim's Small Weenie - One Trunk at a Time!
Post 2 made on Sunday September 5, 2021 at 22:50
Redbiker98
Regular Member
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209
On September 4, 2021 at 00:29, davidcasemore said...

And stop with the endless links to articles with discredited horse-nonsense. If I sent you a link to a magic crystal (only $6,000) which, if you set it on top of your AVR, would increase the frequency response and lower the distortion, would you buy one?

Yes, please.....I need that link. Does the crystal help stop the voices?
Post 3 made on Sunday December 19, 2021 at 10:17
internetraver
Advanced Member
Joined:
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April 2003
798
On September 4, 2021 at 00:29, davidcasemore said...
Really, people. Some of you really believe some stupid sh!t. Hospitals (mostly in red states) are filling their ICUs with mostly unvaccinated fools. And not just the "unhealthy and old". Young people are being hospitalized, too.

What is it going to take to get (some of) you to return to planet Earth and stop this nonsense? Don't you want this to be over so we can go back to the good old days?

Getting vaccinated, wearing a mask, and social distancing are patriotic things to do. What the f*ck is so terrible about putting on a mask? Are you that fragile? This is where libertarianism goes off the deep end.

And stop with the endless links to articles with discredited horse-nonsense. If I sent you a link to a magic crystal (only $6,000) which, if you set it on top of your AVR, would increase the frequency response and lower the distortion, would you buy one?

WOW! I never come to this section (for obvious reasons) but every "news" outlet that reported this fake story had to print a retraction.  Do you ever actually attempt to get any real information on a subject or do you just parrot what you hear from the corrupt media?
Post 4 made on Tuesday December 21, 2021 at 13:08
BizarroTerl
Active Member
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591
I was reading where someone was suing some hospital because the hospital refused to perform/treat a patient with de wormer.

I was wondering - If someone wants to go off the accepted medical treatments and they get sick why do they go to a hospital? If you believe in some Facebook posts over the entire medical establishment then stay home and treat your problem yourself. Just keep the phone number for the coroner readily visible (to make it easier for your family after you're "cured").
Post 5 made on Tuesday December 21, 2021 at 21:24
buzz
Super Member
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On December 19, 2021 at 10:17, internetraver said...
WOW! I never come to this section (for obvious reasons) but every "news" outlet that reported this fake story had to print a retraction.  Do you ever actually attempt to get any real information on a subject or do you just parrot what you hear from the corrupt media?

I’d be interested in these stories and their retractions.
Post 6 made on Wednesday December 22, 2021 at 11:50
tomciara
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On December 21, 2021 at 13:08, BizarroTerl said...
I was reading where someone was suing some hospital because the hospital refused to perform/treat a patient with de wormer.

Just wondering if you were aware of some of the details about this de-wormer.

It is of course actually called Ivermectin and has been around since 1975.

From Wikipedia, not the ultimate resource, but useful for this discussion.  William Campbell and Satoshi Ōmura won the 2015 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine for its discovery and applications. The medication is on the World Health Organization's List of Essential Medicines, and is approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration as an antiparasitic agentIn 2018, ivermectin was the 420th most commonly prescribed medication in the United States, with more than one hundred thousand prescriptions. It is available as a generic medicine.

Maybe it is not all bad.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 7 made on Wednesday December 22, 2021 at 17:49
BizarroTerl
Active Member
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There's no question Ivermectin is a valuable medicine. However the medical community hasn't approved it for Covid and preliminary data isn't encouraging that it will be.
Personally I find it crazy people will avoid a immunization with literally hundreds of million doses given with minimal problems yet they'll flock to some other medicine that is for something totally different. Ever talked to someone that is bat sh*t crazy? Someone that says things that make absolutely no sense? That's how I feel when I talk to someone who is anti vax & pro dewormer. Words come out but they're crazy and make absolutely no sense.
Post 8 made on Wednesday December 22, 2021 at 20:36
tomciara
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On December 22, 2021 at 17:49, BizarroTerl said...
There's no question Ivermectin is a valuable medicine. However the medical community hasn't approved it for Covid and preliminary data isn't encouraging that it will be.
Personally I find it crazy people will avoid a immunization with literally hundreds of million doses given with minimal problems yet they'll flock to some other medicine that is for something totally different. Ever talked to someone that is bat sh*t crazy? Someone that says things that make absolutely no sense? That's how I feel when I talk to someone who is anti vax & pro dewormer. Words come out but they're crazy and make absolutely no sense.

I hear ya.  Strange times indeed.

Some odd occurrences accompanied Covid (captain obvious here).  The issue of “off label”, which is using a drug for something other than the normal prescribed use, is ordinary and commonplace, and never controversial until Covid.  Suddenly an 80 year old drug, accepted the world over, on the World Health Organization’s list of “must have” drugs, and over the counter in several countries, was banned for Covid use. (Hydroxychloroquine)

Lest you think it’s uncommon to go “off label”, someone I know, with debilitating muscle pain gets relief from an antidepressant - sounds odd, but it just happens that doctors learn these things work because they actually treat people and heal people.  So it was early with Covid, where hydroxychloroquine, which is used around the world as a safe, anti-malarial treatment, seemed to get people well quickly and with few hospitalizations at all.  But then it got mysteriously pulled and unavailable, even though doctors were seeing success.

I’m pretty neutral about vaccines, between me, my wife and kids we have had dozens, but this one has been a little different and worth reading and keeping up to date on.  Normal vaccines get years of trials and that way the side effects get figured out.  Here, it’s like RTI or somebody has told us to use this controller and worry about the system crashes later on.

So, I hear ya, keep reading and absorbing data from all sides, and do what’s best for you and your family! Merry Christmas to you.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 9 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 00:34
buzz
Super Member
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People are reliving their teen protest years. Unfortunately, the protest voices are amplified by social media. With respect to rapid vaccine development, this technology has been around in various forms for about 15 years. Now, we can roll out safe vaccines very rapidly. In about 48 hours after the COVID sequence was released a vaccine candidate was available for testing. We don't need months to years of fussing with chicken cultures and such. If the virus mutates, a simple adjustment can be ready for testing rapidly. I know a person who contracted COVID before vaccines were generally available. She was not very sick and did not require hospitalization, but she still does not have any sense of taste.
Post 10 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 11:18
tomciara
Loyal Member
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On December 23, 2021 at 00:34, buzz said...
People are reliving their teen protest years. Unfortunately, the protest voices are amplified by social media. With respect to rapid vaccine development, this technology has been around in various forms for about 15 years. Now, we can roll out safe vaccines very rapidly. In about 48 hours after the COVID sequence was released a vaccine candidate was available for testing. We don't need months to years of fussing with chicken cultures and such. If the virus mutates, a simple adjustment can be ready for testing rapidly.

Only it’s not a traditional vaccine, using dead virus cells. It is mRNA technology, a different critter. Testing could be beneficial or even life saving if reactions become widespread.

Just to broaden your reading, look into what Dr. Robt. Malone has written.  He pioneered the mRNA tech.  He will give the pros and cons. The cons are not well received by the medical community.  It is an odd response.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 11 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 12:35
Anthony
Ultimate Member
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28,871
On December 22, 2021 at 11:50, tomciara said...
Just wondering if you were aware of some of the details about this de-wormer.

It is of course actually called Ivermectin and has been around since 1975.

Maybe it is not all bad.

No one is saying Ivermectin is all bad, or even mostly or even in some important detail bad. If it was it would be taken off the market. Now f tyou are a horse with worms then it is all good


On December 22, 2021 at 20:36, tomciara said...
I hear ya.  Strange times indeed.

Some odd occurrences accompanied Covid (captain obvious here).  The issue of “off label”, which is using a drug for something other than the normal prescribed use, is ordinary and commonplace, and never controversial until Covid.  Suddenly an 80 year old drug, accepted the world over, on the World Health Organization’s list of “must have” drugs, and over the counter in several countries, was banned for Covid use. (Hydroxychloroquine)

Lest you think it’s uncommon to go “off label”, someone I know, with debilitating muscle pain gets relief from an antidepressant - sounds odd, but it just happens that doctors learn these things work because they actually treat people and heal people.  So it was early with Covid, where hydroxychloroquine, which is used around the world as a safe, anti-malarial treatment, seemed to get people well quickly and with few hospitalizations at all.  But then it got mysteriously pulled and unavailable, even though doctors were seeing success.

yes doctors and labs often go off label and there is a lot of good that happens with that.

The issue is what happens next.

There is a reason why tests of new drugs and vaccines divide the subjects into two groups one getting a placebo (something that is known to have no effects) and the other group what is to be tested. that way they can compare the two results. that way you can compare the results of the two groups and say for example proportioionaly speeking the number of people that felt nauseated was equal so that is not a side effect, the number of people that felt better (or what ever) was 20x so that means it is good at doing that.


There was nothing bad with some doctor trying Ivermectin or hydroxychloroquine the problem is that people that metanalysed the information and other doctors that tried to reproduce better results by testing them on their patients saw that it was BS.


yes "hydroxychloroquine seemed to get people well quickly and with few hospitalizations at all" but that was/is also true for people that did not take hydroxychloroquine

 Normal vaccines get years of trials and that way the side effects get figured out.  Here, it’s like RTI or somebody has told us to use this controller and worry about the system crashes later on.

that is not accurate.

First of all every year we get a new flu vaccine developed dependent on what flu strains look to be most important elsewhere in the world.

Second were stuff sped up a bity with the Covid vaccine, absolutely by a lot but not in anything that would impact the health of the vaccinated person after testing. Fund raising which is extremely time consuming kind of got eliminated, the process has stages and all of them got done in normal time but usually each stage tends to be very distinct ( i.e. finish animal trial, spend time writing results, send results to government of specific country, wait for their OK for next stage, raise more funds for small human trial, set-up trial, start next stage) , that was now that was different (i.e. while doing animal trial send results to all the gouvernment that spent $$$$ , governments had a lot more people working an all the ones they spent $$$$ reading results almost in real time, start producing and setting up for human stage before the OK, a few days later when the specific gouvernment gave the OK start the next stage. Normally Canada (where I live) would have only received the documentation for all the stages after just before they are ready to go live (it takes money and resources drug companies don't want to waste before they have to) for something where none of the stages happen here. For Covid vaccine there wer4e more people working in real time examining the results. Which was why it got accepted last Dec for use.

Lastly, being in my 50's I knew I would not be one of the first and I was OK with that, Dec 2020 I was not ready to get the vaccine (wanted it to be tested a bit more) But it is now Dec 2021 many have had their first dose over a year ago and over 3.7B have been vaccinated. how much more trial does someone need?

So, I hear ya, keep reading and absorbing data from all sides,

agree with that but I also think source matters. Medical experts at the top of their field I view what they have to say on medical stuff as a lot more important then a high school drop out that has no medical training.

and do what’s best for you and your family! Merry Christmas to you.

Wish you all the best and Merry Christmas to you and your family as well.
...
Post 12 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 13:07
BHuey1969
Long Time Member
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198
Dr. Robert Malone pioneered the idea of MNRA vaccines, and some very, very early experiments.

Other scientist then took his idea and ran with it, until years later we have what we have now.

Malone, although wealthy in his own rights, is extremely dejected that he has not made a penny off of MNRA vaccines, even though he actually had very little to do with their actual development.

So, now he is going around spreading misinformation to try and downplay the value.

[Link: theatlantic.com]

TBH, I am vaccinated and boosted, and I don't really care if you are on not. It's your choice. If you want to take horse de-wormer, or a malaria drug, that's your choice too. Just don't be a dick about it.
Post 13 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 14:14
buzz
Super Member
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4,371
But the anti crowd, equating their freedom with a no vaxx, no social distancing, no mask attitude are trampling the freedom of the pro crowd who must stay sequestered in order to remain safe. Further, the anti crowd is overloading our medical care systems -- causing extra suffering for both anti and pro camps. While we will not be able to prove that early adoption of masks, distancing, and vaxx, could have stopped this pandemic it's likely that we could all be 'free' at this point.

Look at our past experience with Ebola. Ebola could have been a worse pandemic, but mother nature introduced it in a remote area that had prompt medical reporting, no vocal anti community, and Ebola was contained.
Post 14 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 23:50
tomciara
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On December 23, 2021 at 14:14, buzz said...
But the anti crowd, equating their freedom with a no vaxx, no social distancing, no mask attitude are trampling the freedom of the pro crowd who must stay sequestered in order to remain safe. Further, the anti crowd is overloading our medical care systems -- causing extra suffering for both anti and pro camps.

This needs more of a deep dive.

1. Why does someone who is vaxxed have to be sequestered?  That is a medical error, maybe malpractice, the vax gives the freedom to come and go as you please.  You can’t get infected nor infect anyone else. If you are being forced, by fear or mandate, to sequester, that is absolutely not right.  That was whole reason for the vaccine.

2. Current data does not indicate an anti crowd makes up the majority of hospitalizations.  Some studies yes, some no.  Check out Israel’s studies - one of the highest vaccination rates, many of them get hospitalized anyway.

On a side note, why are the NBA and NFL having so many issues now?
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 15 made on Thursday December 23, 2021 at 23:51
tomciara
Loyal Member
Joined:
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On December 23, 2021 at 13:07, BHuey1969 said...
Dr. Robert Malone pioneered the idea of MNRA vaccines, and some very, very early experiments.

Other scientist then took his idea and ran with it, until years later we have what we have now.

Malone, although wealthy in his own rights, is extremely dejected that he has not made a penny off of MNRA vaccines, even though he actually had very little to do with their actual development.

So, now he is going around spreading misinformation to try and downplay the value.

[Link: theatlantic.com]

TBH, I am vaccinated and boosted, and I don't really care if you are on not. It's your choice. If you want to take horse de-wormer, or a malaria drug, that's your choice too. Just don't be a dick about it.

I don’t think the Atlantic will give you the whole story.  YMMV.

BTW I am not advocating anything other than doing a lot more reading, especially outside the narrow lines of just a few sources.  I think we owe that to ourselves.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
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