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Topic:
Too many threads.... New Policy and Equipment
This thread has 58 replies. Displaying posts 16 through 30.
Post 16 made on Wednesday September 6, 2006 at 16:48
Surf Remote
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5,958
On September 6, 2006 at 15:39, plasmabob said...
>>> Do I run a risk that my remote will be "erased"
if I hook back up to my PC to tweak some of my settings
and/or macros? Will I be able to make programing changes
or has this been somehow disabled (which is hard to imagine)?<<<

No, the old software will work just fine. You just can't do a "Live Update".

Does that mean that maybe I won't get updated versions
of the programming package that might have built-in codes
for new devices? That's not why everyone is bent out
of shape is it?

Yes and yes. Only the new software can access the "Live Update" server, which would give you new codes in the IR database as they're added, as well as any software or firmware improvements.
www.SurfRemoteControl.com

THX-certified video calibrator and contributing writer, ProjectorReviews.com
Post 17 made on Wednesday September 6, 2006 at 16:55
Cincy Dave
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28
CI = Custom Installer
AD = Authorized Dealer
DIY = Do It Yourself
URC = Universal Remote Control
IANAL = I am not a lawyer :)
Post 18 made on Wednesday September 6, 2006 at 17:17
plasmabob
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6
Thanks SurfR and Dave for the clarifications.

Of course if in a year I get lots of new equipment then I guess it would be a drag not to have access to updated codes in the software -- learning commands is a bit of a drag but doable.

Question: I have downloaded a file (not thru URC) that has all of my Panasonic AE900 codes. What's to stop those kinds of files from being shared on the web to people who can't get the "official" codes from URC? They don't seem like those are copyright issues.

And it's fine if you want to tell me to slog through thousands of post . . . which I probably won't do since it sounds like my MX850 will stay programable for me.
Bob B
Post 19 made on Wednesday September 6, 2006 at 19:47
SquiddOhio
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68
BOB:

If your software is working, the only thing you won't get now is a Live Update, which is mostly new codes for new devices. If you are a DIY, then you don't need all these codes anyway. The only codes you will need in the future are codes for a new device you purchase. Most of those codes will be on the remote, and the 850 can learn them quickly. As for the other codes, the discrete on and off codes and the discrete input codes, for example, those will probably be uploaded by some kind user as a device file, which is common now -- in fact, that's where I got most if not all of my discrete codes, often before they made it into the URC database.

In other words, the new URC policy is not all that big a deal for you, as long as users continue to share the device files they create for new equipment as it hits the market.
Post 20 made on Wednesday September 6, 2006 at 20:00
plasmabob
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Squidd,
Thanks. I think I got it all now, but am still a little surprised at the outrage. I'm a DIYer but figure short of an entirely new system with a need for new codes, I am not that put out by the somewhat chincy policy of URC. And my gear largely doesn't (unfortunately) use discrete on/off codes. I've had to program around that, but that's what also makes me a "prosumer" DIYer.

Since I've granted the URC software internet access thru my firewall, I was just concerned that I could actually LOSE current functionality, if URC so wished, which does not seem to be the case. THAT would have freaked me out!
Bob B
Post 21 made on Thursday September 7, 2006 at 15:07
sunstar
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108
On September 5, 2006 at 10:00, Cincy Dave said...

2) Authorized Dealers - they also need to provide access
to the software, but a lot of them may not know about
the new policy or their new responsiblity to their customers,
past and present.

An excellent summarization by Cincy Dave but I would like to make one clarification. According to a CSR at URC each AD can determine which software is made available to the end consumer. They may supply either the version with or without the live-update function. I would also assume that this applies to the CI; I did not ask specifically so this is merely an assumption.

If you contact URC, the CI or AD they should be able confirm the version you will receive. As Cincy Dave mentioned this will most likely prove more difficult with the larger AD's because of the "bureacracy".
Post 22 made on Thursday September 7, 2006 at 22:45
Erebus1954
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On September 6, 2006 at 20:00, plasmabob said...
Since I've granted the URC software internet access thru
my firewall, I was just concerned that I could actually
LOSE current functionality, if URC so wished, which does
not seem to be the case. THAT would have freaked me out!

Bob,

There's really nothing stopping URC from deciding to delete your current functionality in the future as near as I can see. I think it might be wise to disallow URC access through your firewall, as they have proven to unreliable now.
Steve
Post 23 made on Friday September 8, 2006 at 11:55
plasmabob
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6
Point well taken. Since the live update is not working (not that that seems to be a big deal), I guess I should restirict it from accessing the internet so I don't get any unpleasant surprises. Thanks.


On September 7, 2006 at 22:45, Erebus1954 said...
Bob,

There's really nothing stopping URC from deciding to delete
your current functionality in the future as near as I
can see. I think it might be wise to disallow URC access
through your firewall, as they have proven to unreliable
now.
Bob B
Post 24 made on Friday September 8, 2006 at 11:58
Surf Remote
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On September 7, 2006 at 15:07, sunstar said...
An excellent summarization by Cincy Dave but I would like
to make one clarification. According to a CSR at URC
each AD can determine which software is made available
to the end consumer. They may supply either the version
with or without the live-update function.

I wish whoever said that hadn't. It just needlessly causes concern where there should be none. There's no reason to supply the non-updateable version to a customer IMO. Even when I'm doing a local job, I either supply the updateable version or none at all. The customer either needs to be able to change the programming themselves or they don't and that can be done with either version.
www.SurfRemoteControl.com

THX-certified video calibrator and contributing writer, ProjectorReviews.com
Post 25 made on Friday September 8, 2006 at 17:05
sunstar
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108
On September 8, 2006 at 11:58, Surf Remote said...
I wish whoever said that hadn't. It just needlessly causes
concern where there should be none. There's no reason
to supply the non-updateable version to a customer IMO.
Even when I'm doing a local job, I either supply the
updateable version or none at all. The customer either
needs to be able to change the programming themselves
or they don't and that can be done with either version.

I agree with you Surf Remote but this is what the CSR at URC stated. My original question to the CSR was to simply verify that I would receive the software with the live update. I was surprised when she said it was up to the AD and this is when I asked about the specific AD I was considering. I was even placed on hold while she discussed with someone else (I have no idea who) and came back and verified that my AD supplied software with the live update feature. I honestly do not know if this is true since it is possible that the CSR was incorrect. I assumed she spoke to her superior and that he/she would have corrected her if she was wrong.
Post 26 made on Sunday September 10, 2006 at 04:39
Loraquest
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345
Okay, so the AD gets to choose what software we get. Is the Complete Control Suite one of the options, or is it strictly for custom installers? Being an owner of a 700, 850 and 900, it would really be nice to access them all from a single program.
Post 27 made on Monday September 11, 2006 at 13:31
Surf Remote
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On September 10, 2006 at 04:39, Loraquest said...
Okay, so the AD gets to choose what software we get. Is
the Complete Control Suite one of the options, or is it
strictly for custom installers? Being an owner of a 700,
850 and 900, it would really be nice to access them all
from a single program.

Speaking for myself, I am only providing the updateable software. I supply the CCS to anyone who has purchased multiple remotes (usually 3 or more) or if they purchase the MSC-400 (which uses its own and another editor to be open at the same time). Please keep in mind that the CCS installs ALL of the editors (from the 850 on up) on your PC and just provides you with a tool bar to launch them. It does not have the MX-800 or 700 editor in it, so unless you have an 850 plus a few more, it's not really going to help you much.

Getting back to what the tech said about the software, I suppose a dealer could do whatever they wanted regarding the software but there has been no directive from URC to that effect and the tech had no business saying that.

Last edited by Surf Remote on September 11, 2006 18:22.
www.SurfRemoteControl.com

THX-certified video calibrator and contributing writer, ProjectorReviews.com
Post 28 made on Monday September 11, 2006 at 23:20
kyham
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9
Well I am just looking for a new remote and was considering the 3000 but it sounds like that it might be a problem getting updates. That concerns me. If you buy the remote, you should be able to get updates. Sounds like they are requiring everyone to buy a NEW device in order to get support. How about if you buy a used unit from someone upgrading. No matter who you buy it from, they made the device and sold it to dealers. I'm sure they got their money for them.

Sounds like they would lose business with that attitude.

If they make it hard to get updates, then I guess I will not purchase their equipment.
Post 29 made on Tuesday September 12, 2006 at 01:06
Tom Ciaramitaro
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No problem, you will do fine with the remote with the software you will have.

People who have MX500s (un-updateable) still have viable remotes. That's one example of a remote that can keep learning new models any time they are introduced. You can learn any new command from any new device well into the future. You are not obsoleted. Any commands not on the remote are often found right on this website. A regular programmer is always on the hunt for some commands that aren't in the database. That's why we ended up here.

I regularly use older MX software versions and program remotes all the time. I am not unable to do new clients' equipment. Anyone who tells you otherwise is not giving you the straight scoop.

It is tiring to read all the scare posts here. I'd sure be grateful if we could move on.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 30 made on Wednesday September 13, 2006 at 12:31
JonW747
Active Member
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621
On September 12, 2006 at 01:06, Tom Ciaramitaro said...
People who have MX500s (un-updateable) still have viable
remotes. That's one example of a remote that can keep
learning new models any time they are introduced. You
can learn any new command from any new device well into
the future. You are not obsoleted. Any commands not
on the remote are often found right on this website.

Would you like to buy a pair of MX500's?

I purchased a Pinnacle Showcenter 200 which uses "toggle codes". My MX-500's were unable to learn these codes. The MX-800 and MX-850 cannot even learn these codes. The only way I can control the product is by using the codes from the data base and it's still a little shaky.

For the most part you're right, but there are exceptions, and we don't know what manufacturers will do in the future. Live update is an important feature because everyone who purchased a programmable remote through whatever channel expected the remote to last longer then their next equipment purchase.
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