Hi, very, very new to this and could use some help.

Just installed a Channel Master 4228, have it up about 35' and pointing approx SW, in line with Dishnet. Cable is about 30'.

I am receiving a number of channels though most are very fuzzy. Do pick up Grand Island but not very well. I do not think I have this pointing in the right direction. I also have ghosts in most of the channels. The furthest I am receiving is WNYO but not very well. I am setup in the Yonge / Finch area should the 4228 not just point to the right of Yonge St?

Could anyone please give some advice. Thanks

This message was edited by du2772 on 11/12/05 07:34 ET.

You may need a rotor to point the antenna to the precise direction the each distant signal emanates. Also, if possible, use a low loss twin lead as opposed to coaxial cable. Coax may have a longer life than twin lead but it has higher signal loss than a quality twin lead.

I am not familiar with the neighborhood you are in but my guess is that you are surrounded by high rise structures to the south where these signals are coming from. If that is the case, and the rotor does not improve the quality of your reception, you may have to try putting up a taller tower to get a better signal.

Hi if your view south is clear then at 35' you should be ok.

WILW I dont know why you suggested twin lead as RG6 cable has a lower loss plus the cabe is shielded. the twin lead can pickup interference especially if he decide to run a rotor wire.

From your location from my experience I would say that you need to point your antenna more south not south west.

In relation to the cntower more east.

Dish net is west and at that position you will only get the canadian stations.

When you say fuzzy do you mean the picture freezes and pixelates ? then swing your antenna south not south west.

Since he mentions ghosts and fuzziness in the pictures it seems apparent he is talking about Analog TV. I am very new to HDTV and don't know a great deal about it but I have yet to see any fuzziness or ghosting on pictures with marginal quality issues.

Twin Lead has lower signal loss than RG 6. My own personal tests bear this out plus I've had two engineers (one broadcast) tell me the same thing. Coax has higher signal loss but is a bit more durable and will outlast Twin Lead. Twin Lead has lower signal loss but needs to be replaced sooner than Coax.

I just did a head to head comparison here in Buffalo with a high quality low loss Twin Lead and RG 6 and as usual, the Twin Lead won the battle for better picture quality on Analog signals.

WILW opps I thought that because he said 4228 its a uhf antenna that is normally used for hdtv reception.

I normally sell this antenna for hdtv reception. With a digital signal you either get it or dont. There is no ghost or fuzzy in picture quality but rather with a low signal you get pixelates and drop outs, there is no noise in the picture.

On any installs we never use 300 ohm twin leads because it can easily pick up interference especially if you were to run a rotor wire beside it.

More convient for me to use a shielded 75ohm wire.

You could be correct about the loss as I never used 300ohm and only seen it from old installes in the 70's.

A question how did you test the loss in cables is it something that you can see.

Hey guys thanks for the information, I moved the attenna and it now points on a southeastern direction, big improvement.
I am located in the Bathurst / Finch area. Cable I'm running the same cable I use for Satellite R6 I believe, much better than regular coax.
I have much better reception picking up about 17 channels and still have ghosts and fuzziness, some hardly noticeable but others real bad.
I still have to realign the dish, have given up on Rochester and am going to make sure I get all the Buffalo area networks.
Hamilton stations come through very strong but the ghosts make them unviewable.
I have installed an amplifier does this help or hinder?
Any other ideas regarding signal clarity. thanks for your help, really appreciated.

Are you using your setup for hdtv signals or regular UHF ?

Don't bother with Rochester... they're mostly low powered and don't offer anything that Buffalo doesn't already have. Really, a couple degrees can make a difference in reception of distant stations, so you're really going to need to have someone fine tune the antenna while someone else sits there watching the signal level (assuming you're going for HDTV - otherwise you'll just have to watch the ghosting).

Amplifiers are only really useful for overcoming loss due to signal splitting (to multiple TVs). More practical would be a preamplifier, which amplifies the signal right close to the antenna where it's as good as its going to get - but remember that you can't amplify something that isn't there or isn't strong enough to be improved any by amplifiing. And depending on the quality of the amplifier, you can overload it with close stations and make things worse.

Finally, if you're trying to get stations from cities in different directions, you're really going to have to get a rotor.

Yaamon, the Channel Bastard 4228 can be used for analog signals as well as HDTV. In fact any UHF antenna built in the day of analog only signals can be used for HDTV. All this hype about a antenna being HDTV Ready is nothing more than propaganda. Channel Bastard used to market a 7 foot parabolic dish (still have one) and that was outstanding for UHF. Literally created pictures when none were previously present on many channels. That would work great with the new HDTV channels on UHF.

You are correct about twin lead being more susceptible to noise and interference from equipment. Coax has better shielding for that. But the best grades of 300 ohm twin lead lose less signal than RG 6 and especially RG 58 or 59 and will result in a better picture especially for fringe reception. We did head to head tests in years past that confirmed this. And this weekend I tried it again with Ch. 15, a new LPTV station in Buffalo. Used the same antenna and compared the picture quality with RG 6 and 300 ohm. Twin lead was better and reduced the snow.

DU 2772, the amplifier will help with more distant signals but it could also overload your system when it is in use in close proximity to a local signal. If I recall correctly the CN Tower has most of your local TV transmitting antennas. If you are a few miles away from it you probably won't have any trouble with an amplifier overloading your TV's circuits. I tried an amp once but I was only about 4 to 5 miles away from local TV towers and they overloaded my tuner. Made things worse even for distant stations because the local channels came in on everything!

Ghosting is caused by the signal being transmitted from a TV tower being reflected in one or more locations. It could be a hill or very tall, large trees or buildings. Since you are in the city of Toronto I'd hazard a guess that most of the high rises are in the direct path of your home and the desired stations you'd like to receive. In this case the only way to reduce ghosting is to try reorienting the antenna until you can find the best picture. The sure fire way to solve the problem is to mount your antenna much higher but if you are close to a lot of skyscrapers, that may not be practical or cost effective and still may not solve the problem.