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Topic:
IR Emitters (Dumb Question)
This thread has 24 replies. Displaying posts 1 through 15.
Post 1 made on Monday November 7, 2022 at 17:33
charlieklima
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Hi all! Relatively new to remote installations and was wondering if all basic IR emitters are the same. Meaning if I can't use the emitters from the manufacturer of the processor (Pro Control ProLink.z in this case) what do I look for in a replacement/alternative? Are there better brands than others?

Thanks for any help you can provide!
Post 2 made on Monday November 7, 2022 at 17:43
MNTommyBoy
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Broadly, I would say 90% of the emitters out there work with 90% of equipment available. Xantech has always been great when I've needed something else.

Why are the PC emitters a no-go? I understand there are certain circumstances when one might need a naked emitter to embed, or non-flashing style etc...
"There's a big difference between winging it and seeing what happens. Now let's see what happens." ~MacGruber
OP | Post 3 made on Monday November 7, 2022 at 17:56
charlieklima
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I would much prefer to use PC ones but they are out of stock for a couple of weeks and the install is on Thurs. When they are available I'll get a bunch to have them on hand. Not sure why the ProLink.r comes with emitters and the ProlLink.z doesn't
Post 4 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 01:08
Ernie Gilman
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On November 7, 2022 at 17:43, MNTommyBoy said...
Why are the PC emitters a no-go?

Please answer the question. Stuff like this matters.

For me, I like to stick with the same company for everything. There was a time when URC and Xantech used different power voltages, 5 and 12 (and I don't remember which had which). Mixing brands was a problem then.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 5 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 05:42
buzz
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Series resistors are usually included in the emitter assembly. There could be some minor differences here, possibly resulting in lower output. If the emitters are pasted over the equipment's IR sensor, I don't think that these variations would be an issue. I can't recall any examples, but I can remember a seeing an emitter that used a 3-conductor plug. Inserting a 2-conductor plug into a jack that expects a 3-conductor plug could result in issues.
Post 6 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 09:06
highfigh
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On November 9, 2022 at 05:42, buzz said...
Series resistors are usually included in the emitter assembly. There could be some minor differences here, possibly resulting in lower output. If the emitters are pasted over the equipment's IR sensor, I don't think that these variations would be an issue. I can't recall any examples, but I can remember a seeing an emitter that used a 3-conductor plug. Inserting a 2-conductor plug into a jack that expects a 3-conductor plug could result in issues.

The 3 conductor emitters usually had that so a visible flash could be seen.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 7 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 12:56
Fred Harding
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Beg to differ on the 3 conductor emitter. The flash was something you bought as a feature or not; Xantech 283 was flash, 282 was no flash. Same 3.5 mm male mono plug for either.
On the West Coast of Wisconsin
Post 8 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 14:23
Brad Humphrey
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Fred they have me scratching my head as well. I've been doing this for a very long time now and I can't ever remember seeing a 3 conductor emitter. Doesn't make any sense. Maybe some kind of proprietary design I missed during the early 90's, when I was more focused on mobile electronics???
Post 9 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 14:41
Gman
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On November 9, 2022 at 14:23, Brad Humphrey said...
Fred they have me scratching my head as well. I've been doing this for a very long time now and I can't ever remember seeing a 3 conductor emitter. Doesn't make any sense. Maybe some kind of proprietary design I missed during the early 90's, when I was more focused on mobile electronics???

Maybe he is referring to an IR receiver as having 3 conductors ?
Post 10 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 17:40
Fred Harding
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Brad, I was installing Xantech in the early 90's. I still have their tech manual on my shelf. Wasn't them. Wasn't Niles, either. So maybe an esoteric brand....?
On the West Coast of Wisconsin
Post 11 made on Wednesday November 9, 2022 at 22:06
Impaqt
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Most IR receivers have three conductor connectors. and Some IR Blasters back in the day had a third for power.
Post 12 made on Thursday November 10, 2022 at 09:53
highfigh
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On November 9, 2022 at 12:56, Fred Harding said...
Beg to differ on the 3 conductor emitter. The flash was something you bought as a feature or not; Xantech 283 was flash, 282 was no flash. Same 3.5 mm male mono plug for either.

Xantech, sure, but IIRC, Russound, possibly Niles and several others had three conductor cables specifically for the confirmation flash.

How's life at the new company?
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 13 made on Thursday November 10, 2022 at 11:31
tomciara
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On November 10, 2022 at 09:53, highfigh said...
Xantech, sure, but IIRC, Russound, possibly Niles and several others had three conductor cables specifically for the confirmation flash.

My IR experience goes back to the early 90’s and never in my life have I seen a three conductor emitter.

With Xantech, you could buy a standard emitter or a visible emitter, with no difference at the plug. Supposing there were three conductor plugs, what would they connect to? A 789–44 connecting block didn’t have two and three conductor jacks, nor did URC, RTI, or any other IR base station/extender systems I can think of. RTI had multi-conductor jacks on the RP-6 processor for their proprietary dongles, but included 4” long adapter to make them 2-conductor emitter friendly.

I have some old emitters in my truck, including some single plug dual emitter options, and a twin-plug single emitter to connect to two separate control  systems at once, but nothing in three conductor.

Electrically speaking, there is no need for a third conductor as the emitter for the equipment and the visible LED can simply be paralleled.

I think your memory might be getting a little foggy lol

Last edited by tomciara on November 10, 2022 11:42.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 14 made on Thursday November 10, 2022 at 15:05
Ernie Gilman
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On November 9, 2022 at 12:56, Fred Harding said...
Beg to differ on the 3 conductor emitter. The flash was something you bought as a feature or not; Xantech 283 was flash, 282 was no flash. Same 3.5 mm male mono plug for either.

Yes.
And Fred should (nd does) know this better than we do because if he sent the wrong product, his customer had problems!

Blanket statement: I've NEVER seen an emitter with a three-conductor plug.

Another detail about the blink IRs is that they had two LEDs, in series, in each one, with a series resistor; one LED was an IR emitter, the other was a visible light emitter. All LEDs have a voltage drop across them, so if a blink IR was used with an IR system using 5 volts, there might not be enough voltage to light up the LEDs.

Fred just reminded me that the brand I was talking about, that operated at 5 volts, was Niles.

On November 10, 2022 at 11:31, tomciara said...
Electrically speaking, there is no need for a third conductor as the emitter for the equipment and the visible LED can simply be paralleled.

Well, maybe.
Two LEDs can be paralleled if they turn on at EXACTLY the same voltage. If one LED turns on at, say, 2.2 volts and another in parallel with that one turns on at 2.3 volts, then the 2.3 volt one will never turn on because the 2.2 volt one will pull the voltage across the diodes down to 2.2 volts.

If all the LEDs turn on at exactly the same voltage, then two in parallel can work. LEDs from the same manufacturing batch have the greatest likelihood of having identical turn-on voltages. Since we generally see LEDs of the same batch, their turn-on voltages rarely differ. But they can.

The reason for a resistor in series with an LED is to make sure that no single LED drags the applied voltage down below where other LEDs would turn on.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 15 made on Thursday November 10, 2022 at 16:07
Fred Harding
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On November 10, 2022 at 09:53, highfigh said...
Xantech, sure, but IIRC, Russound, possibly Niles and several others had three conductor cables specifically for the confirmation flash.

How's life at the new company?

Doing well. We got 30 CDI1000's in two weeks ago. They are, of course, all gone. But every once in a while stuff shows up that we expected to arrive six months in the future...
On the West Coast of Wisconsin
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