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Topic:
Best tester kit for long run POE camera installation.
This thread has 27 replies. Displaying posts 16 through 28.
Post 16 made on Wednesday August 12, 2020 at 21:27
Brad Humphrey
Super Member
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350ft should not have been a deal breaker. I've cat cat5e go 450ft with POE and no problems before. Seen it go even further than that to (I didn't do any of those).
So I think more was going on.
Post 17 made on Thursday August 13, 2020 at 01:11
Ernie Gilman
Yes, That Ernie!
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There's something about dimensions in this world that you've got to remember.

This is MY STORY, a long, long one, and if you read it, don't complain to me. It tells why the US will never fully convert to metric. After writing this, I think that the reason is similar to why Americans think they're defending their rights when they don't wear masks. It's stupid and juvenile, but hey.... that's life sometimes. Anyway, forge ahead:

On August 12, 2020 at 20:40, andrewinboulder said...
Turned out the guy who laid the burial grade cable did not put the cable in the conduit .  He laid it next to the conduit.  Wtf.  He also ran it in such a way as to exceed the 328 ft limit by just a bit. Annoying.

What's annoying is how they came to that "limit."

I recently saw an internet article that mentioned a surfer who had surfed a wave that was 24.4 meters high. I was considering what kind of movable surveying equipment would be involved in making such a measurement when I realized we were all being fooled, starting with the idiot who called out the initial wave height.

I mean, how high is 24.4 meters? It turns out that if you pluck a random number out of the air, say 3.28, and multiply 24.4 by that, then you'll get 80.032. And 3.28 just happens to be the conversion factor between feet and meters.

So, some surfdude layabout is leaning back, enjoying the action, when he blurts out, "Man, that wave has GOT to be eighty feet high!"

And some senseless science nerd, not from the US, overhears this and, knowing that eighty feet doesn't mean anything to his audience, he calculates how many meters that is. For his audience. And it's 24.4 meters. I mean, if you round off. The number that was in the published article. (This is also an indictment of copy editors. If there still are any, they're horrible at their jobs.)

So the article has a ridiculously precise measurement for a wave which is a conversion into metric of a silly mad estimate of a wave height. You know, it coulda been 75 feet. Or even 85.

So... guess how the industry came up with 328 feet as the maximum cable length for that camera? That's right... some people did a bunch of design, and experiment, and confirmation, and manufacturing, and testing, and confirmation, and came up with cable that is GUARANTEED to pass the signal one hundred meters.

One hundred meters.

Which just happens to convert to 328 feet.

Calling the maximum "328 feet" ignores what happened and ignores the reality of how people understand things. It's quite possible that this cable could pass a signal, guaranteed, say, 108 meters, which would be 354.4 feet.

If that were the case, then the wire would be specced at 350 feet. The metric crew might be reasonable and also spec 108 meters, even though there's about three inches differences between the two measurements.

And the US won't convert to metric until metric numbers can be presented in ways that don't involve more precision than we can normally deal with. I mean, hell, they could have said 330 feet and nobody would get hurt, right? Do you suppose if ALL the lengths of cable will work at 328 feet, that any of them won't work at 330 feet?
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 18 made on Thursday August 13, 2020 at 09:49
SWFLMike
Long Time Member
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354
On August 12, 2020 at 20:40, andrewinboulder said...
Why it worked for a a year and the suddenly stopped is a little odd.



Would be open to hearing of an alternative product that would do the same thing at a lesser cost.

Those look like the Veracity Long Span units I've used in a similar situation. I recommended them in another thread (sorry if I'm repeating myself...), but they were a little less than the units you mentioned (based on their website). I got the Veracity units at ADI too.

Anyway, as for the first part, that it seems a bit odd that this happened, I had something very similar happen to me which I posted about on here about a year ago.

[Link: remotecentral.com]


Cliffnotes version - weird as it seems, it looks like the range of these sorts of extenders seems to diminish over time. I'm 100% open to interpretation on this, because it still eludes me. This is the job I ended up using the Veracity units in, and they're still working well. I wasn't about to buy another set of expensive Mobotix boxes that they won't help me with.
Post 19 made on Thursday August 13, 2020 at 13:19
SWOInstaller
Select Member
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On August 13, 2020 at 01:11, Ernie Gilman said...
There's something about dimensions in this world that you've got to remember.

This is MY STORY, a long, long one, and if you read it, don't complain to me. It tells why the US will never fully convert to metric. After writing this, I think that the reason is similar to why Americans think they're defending their rights when they don't wear masks. It's stupid and juvenile, but hey.... that's life sometimes. Anyway, forge ahead:

Ernie, As someone in Canada who is seeing more and more measurements in metric (in the construction field, i've lived with km, metres, etc my whole life) it will only be a matter of time before the US is forced to switch. When I started in this field every drawing we received was in imperial, all our wire was sold by the foot. Now every drawing we get is in metric, all our wire is sold by the metre (except for Crestron wire). Majority of the devices now only have metric measurements (especially the appliances and stuff coming from Europe). It will be a matter of time before or wood mills are no longer cutting an 8' 2x4 but a 2.03m 2.5x10cm piece of wood.
You can't fix stupid
OP | Post 20 made on Thursday August 13, 2020 at 16:52
andrewinboulder
Select Member
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On August 13, 2020 at 09:49, SWFLMike said...
Those look like the Veracity Long Span units I've used in a similar situation. I recommended them in another thread (sorry if I'm repeating myself...), but they were a little less than the units you mentioned (based on their website). I got the Veracity units at ADI too.

Anyway, as for the first part, that it seems a bit odd that this happened, I had something very similar happen to me which I posted about on here about a year ago.

[Link: remotecentral.com]

Cliffnotes version - weird as it seems, it looks like the range of these sorts of extenders seems to diminish over time. I'm 100% open to interpretation on this, because it still eludes me. This is the job I ended up using the Veracity units in, and they're still working well. I wasn't about to buy another set of expensive Mobotix boxes that they won't help me with.

Funny you should say that because I had another job that was close to the limits (also burial grade but actually going through conduit for sure) that suddenly refuses to stay connected.

I put another enable IT unit on it and now it works.

The other job has been flawless since I put in the enable it unit in.

After dicking around with it, all I care is that it works and stays connected after I leave.
Post 21 made on Thursday August 13, 2020 at 18:48
davidcasemore
Super Member
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3,352
On August 13, 2020 at 01:11, Ernie Gilman said...
After writing this, I think that the reason is similar to why Americans think they're defending their rights when they don't wear masks. It's stupid and juvenile, but hey.... that's life sometimes. Anyway, forge ahead:

But wearing clothes doesn't trample on their rights? Thank god it doesn't because I'd hate to see some of the MAGA crowd without clothes on.

The best excuse for not wearing masks are the ones from Q-Anon and others:

- The mask causes the virus.

- The wire strip across the nose is a 5G antenna.

- 5G causes the virus.

- That pedophile Tom Hanks wears a mask (well, except when he's drinking the blood of children in the basement of a pizzeria).
Fins: Still Slamming' His Trunk on pilgrim's Small Weenie - One Trunk at a Time!
OP | Post 22 made on Tuesday August 18, 2020 at 08:59
andrewinboulder
Select Member
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Ran across the in C4 forums

Looks very cool for the price and would have cost me way less than the Fluke!

https://pockethernet.com/
Post 23 made on Tuesday August 18, 2020 at 09:13
buzz
Super Member
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May 2003
4,366
On August 13, 2020 at 13:19, SWOInstaller said...
it will only be a matter of time before the US is forced to switch.

Bean counters could justify this by making the case that education costs could be lowered -- there would be no reason to teach fractions. And think of the pain that will be eliminated for school children.
Post 24 made on Tuesday August 18, 2020 at 10:34
tomciara
Loyal Member
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7,958
On August 13, 2020 at 13:19, SWOInstaller said...
it will only be a matter of time before the US is forced to switch.

We started to switch in the 1970’s, with speed limit signs in mph and kph.

Feedback was apparently not so good, perhaps the reality of retrofit set in, and the signs disappeared.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 25 made on Tuesday August 18, 2020 at 11:58
SWOInstaller
Select Member
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On August 18, 2020 at 10:34, tomciara said...
We started to switch in the 1970’s, with speed limit signs in mph and kph.

Feedback was apparently not so good, perhaps the reality of retrofit set in, and the signs disappeared.

So does the UK, but they still managed to change all other measurements to the metric system
You can't fix stupid
Post 26 made on Tuesday August 18, 2020 at 14:44
Brad Humphrey
Super Member
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On August 18, 2020 at 08:59, andrewinboulder said...
Ran across the in C4 forums

Looks very cool for the price and would have cost me way less than the Fluke!

https://pockethernet.com/

That looks cool.
But a couple of points: The TDR measurement on the Fluke goes a lot further. The accuracy on the Fluke is listed as much better. The Fluke is a dedicated device and will always work when you need it - no worries about BT connectivity or app crashing (I read several people complaining of that).
So you are getting what you pay for.
Post 27 made on Wednesday August 19, 2020 at 11:21
tomciara
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It is amazing what a great job they do on test equipment. Especially starting with a name like Fluke. Some of the audio brands have some questionable names… Pyle amps, Schiit DACs. Who names these outfits, anyway?
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 28 made on Thursday August 20, 2020 at 00:31
P2P
Long Time Member
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April 2012
282
On August 18, 2020 at 14:44, Brad Humphrey said...
That looks cool.
But a couple of points: The TDR measurement on the Fluke goes a lot further. The accuracy on the Fluke is listed as much better. The Fluke is a dedicated device and will always work when you need it - no worries about BT connectivity or app crashing (I read several people complaining of that).
So you are getting what you pay for.

I've had one of these for a few years now.  It definitely doesn't replace my Fluke kit, but it is a pretty decent secondary tester.  I have never had any BT or app crashing issues with it.  I use it mostly for network cabling in racks.

I reach for the Fluke for testing and mapping of network cables throughout a house.
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