Trying to install and IR Distribution block for equipment that is out of line of site of my pronto. Having trouble getting the DirecTV HR22 as well as the Polk Xrt12 XM Tuner to work. Smarthome rep thinks they are operating at a IR Frequency greater than the unit I purchased, which would mean a simple swap. Would like to try and confirm before purchasing another product. Does anyone know the freqency of these two units?? Searching online but to no avail. Thanks in advance!

I expect you have learned some IR signals from those devices into your Pronto. Hopefully you know, or can figure out, how to get to the Pronto Hex string for a learned signal in ProntoEdit.

If you post a Pronto Hex string, many people here would know how to tell you the frequency. Or, you could get the IrTool program and paste in the pronto hex string and it will tell you the frequency.

What frequency range does your current IR Distribution system support?

The pronto works terrific, and has for some time. However, we just moved the equipment into a cradenza with wooden doors (as opposed to glass) and my wife doesn't like me opening them every time I use the system. So, I want to use an IR distribution block ([Link: smarthome.com]). Works great on all my Denon and Pioneer Elite equipment. However, cannot get the Directv HR22 or the Polk XM tuner to work. Apparently, the unit I have picks up IR signals between 30-60khz and the HR22 and XM tuner may work at frequencies between 60-100khz. If so, I just need to swap out the unit I purchased. But, it's a $150 piece and with UPS costs back and forth, I'd rather nail it down before ordering another kit.

Here is a sample hex string for the XM tuner:

5000 0000 0000 0001 001B 004C

Cannot post one for the DVR as I used the database codes for all functions. None needed to be learned.

Does it retransmit at those same frequencies? Some units might pick up a wide range of frequencies but only retransmit at 38Khz.


I really doubt that. The HR10-250 uses the Tivo IR code set, which is at 38KHz. I would be surprised if any DirecTV device uses IR outside of 36Khz to 56Khz.


That is 36Khz. It would work even with the crudest IR distribution systems that run only at 38Khz (IR isn't picky about small differences in frequency, such as 36Khz vs. 38Khz).

So something else (not frequency) is wrong. Best guess is the physical location of the transmit portion of your IR distribution device.

36Khz to 40Khz will work with almost any IR distribution system, so even if we don't trust the "60-100khz" claim, I wouldn't suspect frequency to be the problem unless you have learned signals for the DirecTv and they are over 40Khz.


Don't you have an original remote? You can learn a signal even if you didn't NEED to learn a signal.

You might also consider testing the IR distribution system with the Pronto and an original remote: You'll probably need two people for this. Use the Pronto to learn a signal from the Xantech IR emitter while you send the signal from the original remote to the Xantech IR receiver. If you post the resulting Pronto Hex, I can tell you what if any distortion the process introduces (including any frequency shift).

Okay, alot of information...thanks. I'll try to respond to it all.

1. I'm told that the Xantech retransmits at the same frequency as the original signal. I'd think it would have to otherwise the equipment wouldn't respond. Doesn't all equipment have an inherent carrier frequency and it ignores all signals on other frequencies?

2. The Xantec directions, as well as the person at smarthome that I spoke to, indicated that many DBS and Cable boxes operate at frequencies higher than 60 khz. I do have other distribution blocks at home (e.g., in the kitchen for instance where the DBS box is above the cabinet out of sight and the TV is an LCD mounted on a folding bracket under the cabinet) and it works fine, but they are low def boxes and the DVR is brand new and HD, so I'm assuming (and I could be wrong) that it might be on a different frequency, especially since the Xantec manual and the person at Smarthome indicated the same possibility.

3. If the XM tuner is at 36 khz, I'm dumbfounded as I tried everything to get it to work and couldn't. It worked in under 5 min on a Denon AV Receiver, Denon CD, Denon DVD, Pioneer Elite Blu-Ray, etc. The HR22 and XM tuner were impossible. Got very limited intermittent use on with the HR22, but the XM tuner was the worst. Forget intermittent. Couldn't get a a response a single time in over 3 hours of fiddling with it.

4. I guess I could post a learned code for the DVR...didn't think of learning one just for the sake of posting. Can try that. Going to start another post to see if someone is successfully using and HR22 with stick on emitters. Maybe they can provide me with the brands of the equipment.

I so appreciate your trying to help. I'm totally at a loss, and I'm very tech savy. I usually can figure stuff out and I'm totally stumped, as well as frustrated and bumbed.

Are you sure that you've stuck the emitters in the right place, directly over the IR sensors?
Have you checked that the emitters are actually working? View them using a digital camera, while transmitting a signal - you should see the IR LED glowing bluish-white.

okay one thing at a time, The Polk TT12 has an IR carrier frequency if 36000 and uses the RC5 protocol from philips. I am also just about positive that the IR carrier frequency of the HR 22 is the same freq as the TiVo remote which is in the range of 36000 to 40000. probably 38000.

The Xantech distribution system generate no inherent carrier frequencies, but uses what it gets. It is a repeater. It is limitied that its circuitry is built to work best with signals in the frequency range of about 20000 to 60000.

I would start the troubleshooting by getting the two devices to work directly from the Pronto/RFX, using short emitter cables with the equipent close together with no repeaters between them. Emitters directly off the RFX and pasted properly on the equipment. This will verify the codes, the operation of the emitters and their placement. I would then run the long wires carefully between the working emitters and the RFX unit in its permanent location. I would do this all one emitter at a time. Lastly I would add a xantech amplified distribution block to be driven from the RFX and then to drive each emitter. For testing (or for permanent runs) a spare pair from an ethernet cat 5 cable is fine (Blue/bluwht is a good choice as brown/brnwht is sometimes used for POE.

The Xantech distribution block will drive hundereds to thousands of feet. Wiring polarity counts and I always test with Emitters that emit visible light so I can can see what is going on. Xantech sells some called dinky-links that I just keep around for new installls and trobleshooting.

I suspect a wiring error (Polarity reversal). Also the POLK tuner uses RC5 porotocol which is a toggling protocol and needs to be properly learned and can not just be pasted in from learned codes. In a toggling protocol like RC5 or RC6 a single bit changes value 0-1-0-1 with each transmission.

Okay. First off, thanks for your reply. Very much appreciate you taking the time to respond.

I'm not using an RFX, but am using a dinky link receiver to the Xantec distribution block. Wanted to avoid changing the remote to RF as I also have X10 codes being used for Lighting and Appliance control of our fireplace in the room. I'm then using dinky link emitters connected to the dinky link distribution block. It's sold as a kit from smarthome ([Link: smarthome.com]). The equipment is right on top of each other so very close, and the distribution block is right there as well. Less than 12 inches. The emitters are like 4 ft in length, but those are the ones that came with the kit, and you obviously don't want to shorten them. There's no issue with polarity as they do not have bare wire ends, they just plug in and noticeably blink.

Both devises currently work terrific with the TSU9400, and have for 4 months (been using it with the cabinet doors open until I had a chance to install the ir distribution block). No complaints or problems with missed codes. The Polk codes were learned from the original remote through the TSU9400 as it wasn't in the PEP database. Works fine again for about 4 months and counting.

Now I'm really stumped. If both the TT12 and the HR22 have frequencies less than 60 khz, then I totally don't know why what I have isn't working. The emitters are definitely working. I've even swapped the emitters from a component that is responding to one that is not to ensure it's not the emitters and it wasn't. I also took the one that wouldn't work to control the HR22/TT12 and placed it on another component and it worked fine. So it's not the emitters. I also tried changing ports on the distribution block to ensure it wasn't a bad connection. That made no difference either??????

Let me ask, it seems like the RFX9400 doesn't broadcast all signals on all IR emitter ports, but that you have to assign each component in the control pannel an IR port in the RFX. That's problematic for instance, on my TV devise where some of the buttons (volume, mute, etc.) control the AV receiver, the majority control the DBS box, and some control the Sony TV. I'd also need to use multiple RFX9400s as I need 8 components linked up. This is why I've totally avoided using the RFX. Seems like a much more complicated and less easy to implement solution. I was able to do this easily with the Xantec by just using dual emitters and hiding a receiver on the front of the TV. The Xantec solution just seemed so easy except for the fact I cannot for the life of me get these last two components to work properly!!

Based upon what you have bought and stated it should all work. If you take the Pronto and hold it in front of the comonent and send the IR pattern directly to each of the comonents, do each of them work properly?

If that is the case and when you insert the DL receiver connecting block and emitters and aim a the DL receiver Carefully shielding each component so it can only see the IR from its stick on emitter:

Do any of the componets work when you send the IR to the DL receiver

If none work then either the receiver or the connecting block does not work.

If at least one works, does it work from any and all ports of the connecting block? If it does work from all then The connecting block and DL receiver are fine and one would assume that you have a bad emitter or it is not stuck on in the correct place.

If it works from only some ports then you have a bad connecting block

1. All components work FLAWLESSLY when aiming the pronto directly at the components.

2. Three Denon components (AV Receiver, DVD and CD Player) as well as a Pioneer Elite BluRay player work with the emitters stuck over their IR Receivers.

3. I have tried trouble shooting by swapping emitters and emitter ports from the distribution block. That doesn't seem to be the problem. The problem is only with the two components I mentioned, and it happens with any emitters running off of any emitter ports.

4. Tried for 3 hours without sucess to find a suitable place for the emitters for this component. The TT12 never worked at all. The HR22 worked intermittently if I had the TSU9400 at a very steep angle to the IR receiver and within 3 feet, and had something over the front of the emitter and the HR22 to ensure there was no bleed through (such as a t-shirt or my hand).

Sounds like you've tried just about everything, but have you tried using the original remotes with the IR extender?

If the original remotes fail, it really only leaves 2 possibilities:

The IR extender is modifying the codes.
Despite hours of trying, you haven't found the right place to stick the emitters onto the devices.


Might be worth trying a simple IR extender, rather than the fancy one you're using. I bought a no-name extender on eBay UK for 10GBP (15USD). The receiver looks like a computer mouse, if you want to search eBay USA.
This device works perfectly with my TSU9600 and Arcam AV amp, which is very fussy about aligning the remote, as the IR receiver is mounted deep behind the fascia.

Some European cable/satellite/TV boxes have the facility to use a "magic eye". This is a device that connects in-line with the RF (antenna) output to remote TVs, receiving the IR signals and passing them back to the box via the coaxial cable.
Do US boxes have this facility?
I couldn't find where to stick the emitter onto my Sky HD satellite PVR, so I'm using a "magic eye" - works perfectly.

No, I haven't tried using the original remote, so will definitely try that. That will determine for sure if it's a problem with the IR repeater or the box itself.

I haven't heard of a "magic eye" but will try and find out if there is one available in the us. It's also been suggested to me to (i) cover the eye on the box with painters tape under the emitter and (ii) cover the second frequency receiving eye on the receiver to reduce cross talk. Will try both those ideas also. Let's see if I can get this to work. Will be a real shame if I can't.

Barry seems to know a lot more about the IR distribution systems than I do, so he is giving you better suggestions than I could. But the above quoted info about RC5 and RC6, while correct, is just a distraction. You have told us enough to show that is not any significant portion of your current problem.

I wonder if the IR emitter is too strong and is overloading the IR receiver in those two devices. If that were the problem, I expect you have have accidentally solved it while experimenting with emitter locations, but I'm not sure.

The only other idea I have for diagnosing it is the one I already suggested: Try learning from the original remote through the IR distribution system into the Pronto. If your IR distribution system is doing something wrong, we should be able to diagnose it from the learned signal.


Most equipment is not at all picky about moderate differences in IR frequency. So a device designed for a remote at 36Khz should work just fine with a cruder IR distribution system that retransmits at 38Khz, but might fail with one that retransmits at 40Khz. A device expecting 56Khz would almost certainly fail with a 38Khz IR distribution system (but Barry seems to be supporting my guess that your Directv uses Tivo IR signals at 38Khz). So the it seems very unlikely that frequency is the problem.

Most IR remote controls use 38Khz. Most of those that don't use 38Khz use either 36Khz or 40Khz. All of those work with crude IR distribution systems that retransmit everything at 38Khz. The next most common frequency is 56Khz, which would require a better IR distribution system, but you probably don't have any devices that use 56Khz, and you have an IR distribution system that claims to retransmit such signals correctly.

Ted K,

I'm struggling with a Polk unit too. I haven't had any trouble with Tivo's.

I think that it is a signal strength issue. Using a pinhole does not seem like a good idea to me because it has more effect on the incidence angle than signal strength and if the IR wraps around the edges of the mask you may not accomplish much.

Two avenues that I will try ... when I have time. First, enclose the emitter with increasingly dense tape, paper, or whatever. You can more easily avoid sneak paths if you control emission. Install a variable resistor in series with the emitter. This will allow very fine control over the IR intensity.

In my case there are multiple emitters in the cabinet and it is difficult to mask all of the emitters. It is possible that another nearby emitter is overloading the Polk, even though I have limited emission from the official emitter.

I've seen some units allow/accept enough IR leakage trough the rear of the unit to cause trouble. Simply masking the front panel is not enough.

In my Polk installation, a reflection from the wall opposite the equipment is in the loop. In some cases, if I place my body "just so", the Polk unit will work. While I am not completely satisfied with the following explanation, it may be possible that the Polk unit is sensitive to pulse edges and that the combined IR from multiple emitters and room reflections degrades the pulse edges enough to cause trouble.

As a general note, I have not had reliable results using simple tape to block IR transmission. If I want to completely block IR, I use a relatively large patch of aluminum foil. (you can then cover the foil with a more attractive material) Take care not to flex the foil too much or you may develop pinholes. You may need to cover a wide area in order to avoid sneak paths though the unit's plastic control panel. Always consider the possibility that IR may be entering from the rear. Materials that appear opaque to visible light may be IR transmissive.

Things can become very strange. In one installation I was using an IR receiver and the system had a history of intermittent poor performance. Naturally, when I was on the scene, things worked well. Finally, I took an oscilloscope to the site and observed the signal from the IR receiver. There was obvious noise on the IR receiver's output. After a while I realized that when I stood in certain spots, the noise disappeared and the system behaved. The problem also followed the sun. This was surprising because the system is installed in a shaded room on the north end of the house and the IR receiver faced north. There was a small patch of wallpaper opposite the IR receiver that could receive some indirect sunlight. After I installed a sun filter on the IR receiver the system worked well. Evidently, something on that wall was being stimulated to emit enough IR to degrade the signal to noise ratio of the IR signals.

Hi,

I can see that you have tried alomst everything.
Just one thing that comes to my mind. What kind of IR transmitter are you using? (Blik or no blink)

The reason for this question is that the "blink" and then "no blink" are not transmitting the IR signal on the same wavelength.

I have see cases where then blink was not working but the "no blink" was worknig.