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To those of you that observe, happy new year.
This thread has 64 replies. Displaying posts 16 through 30.
Post 16 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 02:04
tomciara
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Oh man, opening up a can of worms...

Proverbs 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
OP | Post 17 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 08:01
Dave in Balto
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On September 25, 2015 at 00:17, SecurelySound said...
I started reading this thread and started debating with myself whether or not to throw in a comment. But, something struck me that Julie wrote. I have come to firmly believe that organized religion is not necessary to be the best person we can be. Have respect for others, treat others with utmost respect, realize that being here is a precious gift (although short), Question everything and always seek to learn something new.

I agree. I'm conflicted on the subject (thanks mom and dad). I'm Jewish (barely), my wife is Catholic. I understand why some people feel the need for religion, and if that helps them maintain an even path, then go with it.

I believe in the nature of karma, all things come to a head.

What I despise are people who are good and god fearing in Sunday, and then horrible people the rest of the week.

Kind of like the weekend crack head.
Hey, careful man, there's a beverage here!

The Dude
Post 18 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 09:00
Fins
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On September 25, 2015 at 08:01, Dave in Balto said...
What I despise are people who are good and god fearing in Sunday, and then horrible people the rest of the week.

Geez, you sound like my AA sponsor
Civil War reenactment is LARPing for people with no imagination.

Post 19 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 09:34
highfigh
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On September 25, 2015 at 08:01, Dave in Balto said...
I agree. I'm conflicted on the subject (thanks mom and dad). I'm Jewish (barely), my wife is Catholic. I understand why some people feel the need for religion, and if that helps them maintain an even path, then go with it.

I believe in the nature of karma, all things come to a head.

What I despise are people who are good and god fearing in Sunday, and then horrible people the rest of the week.

Kind of like the weekend crack head.

Here, we have the families of murder victims who were hardened criminals, gang members and known to be horrible people going on the news, wailing and gnashing their teeth & saying things like "He was a good boy, a church-going boy. Where were the police? They should have stopped this!". However, with the prevailing local attitude being "Snitches get stitches", I don't know why they would think this.

I have always wondered about the attraction between some Catholics and Jews- I think it may be due to the ingrained guilt. :D
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 20 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 10:15
goldenzrule
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On September 25, 2015 at 09:34, highfigh said...
I have always wondered about the attraction between some Catholics and Jews- I think it may be due to the ingrained guilt. :D

I'm a CI. I couldn't afford a Jewish girl, so I got me a Christian gal.
Post 21 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 10:34
juliejacobson
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On September 25, 2015 at 00:17, SecurelySound said...
I started reading this thread and started debating with myself whether or not to throw in a comment. But, something struck me that Julie wrote. I have come to firmly believe that organized religion is not necessary to be the best person we can be. Have respect for others, treat others with utmost respect, realize that being here is a precious gift (although short), Question everything and always seek to learn something new.

I certainly don't need religion to be a better person (I don't believe in a higher power and I never will), but I do need a community, an excuse to be contemplative, and encouragement to do good deeds.
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
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Post 22 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 12:24
highfigh
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On September 25, 2015 at 10:34, juliejacobson said...
I certainly don't need religion to be a better person (I don't believe in a higher power and I never will), but I do need a community, an excuse to be contemplative, and encouragement to do good deeds.

You need an excuse to be contemplative? Go for a drive. Every time I drive, I try to figure out what's wrong with everybody. That's contemplative, right? :D

I worked for a place that demanded a lot of my time and at one point, I REALLY needed a vacation. I hadn't had a real one in quite a while and some friends had set up a rafting trip in the Grand Canyon. After that, nothing seemed as important or out of control as it had before.

Still, it's not the place, it's just a matter of stopping to think. It's really easy in a place like the Canyon- people had to make a living from the land and whatever was available and I was worried about some idiots at work? Pfffft!
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 23 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 15:22
juliejacobson
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On September 25, 2015 at 12:24, highfigh said...
You need an excuse to be contemplative? Go for a drive.

Yeah, like: You need an excuse to exercise? Go for a jog!
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
www.cepro.com
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Post 24 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 15:34
Ernie Gilman
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On September 25, 2015 at 10:34, juliejacobson said...
I certainly don't need religion to be a better person (I don't believe in a higher power and I never will), but I do need a community, an excuse to be contemplative, and encouragement to do good deeds.

Wisdom right there.

Julie, when I read this, I remembered something (no, I wasn't saving it up) I recently heard on the Dennis Prager show. Let's propose that the New York Times is NOT a right-wing religious rag. I think we can all agree on that. Well, lookie here:

ONE of the most striking scientific discoveries about religion in recent years is that going to church weekly is good for you. Religious attendance — at least, religiosity — boosts the immune system and decreases blood pressure. It may add as much as two to three years to your life. The reason for this is not entirely clear.

This is from [Link: nytimes.com], written by an anthropologist in April 2013. And one thing you can say about an anthropologist is that she's probably been exposed to A LOT of teaching that disparages organized religion.

Social support is no doubt part of the story. At the evangelical churches I’ve studied as an anthropologist, people really did seem to look out for one another.

Julie, everyone, you may not have any need for a higher power, but excuse me, more than one person is already a higher power than you alone, and if you're part of an organization where they may help you, where you may experience the wonderful feeling of helping others, or even just where you can get together and bounce ideas off one another, you're exposing yourself to a higher power and probably getting something good out of it.

Note that this is regardless of what the religion is. You can argue about this; you can hairsplit by citing the most wacko religions, but in the end this is true: church*, synagogue, temple, mosque, whatever, is, in general good for your health.




*Except in one middle eastern country I've seen, where you really can't have something named "church," so the food chain Church's Chicken uses the same colors and artwork style, but is called Texas Chicken.

A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 25 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 16:13
Mac Burks (39)
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On September 25, 2015 at 15:34, Ernie Gilman said...
*Except in one middle eastern country I've seen, where you really can't have something named "church," so the food chain Church's Chicken uses the same colors and artwork style, but is called Texas Chicken.


We have a similar religion based issue with a fast food chain here in the United States....

West Coast Infidels call it Carl's Jr. Here in God's country we call it by it's real name...Hardees Charbroiled THICKburgers!

Avid Stamp Collector - I really love 39 Cent Stamps
Post 26 made on Friday September 25, 2015 at 16:27
juliejacobson
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Amen, Ernie. I had read that anthropologist's report and I love Dennis Prager.
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
www.cepro.com
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Post 27 made on Saturday September 26, 2015 at 06:04
Archibald "Harry" Tuttle
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I'm just a Goy, or so I been told. I know the score.
I came into this game for the action, the excitement. Go anywhere, travel light, get in, get out, wherever there's AV trouble, a man alone.
Post 28 made on Saturday September 26, 2015 at 07:29
goldenzrule
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On September 26, 2015 at 06:04, Archibald "Harry" Tuttle said...
I'm just a Goy, or so I been told. I know the score.

I call my wife "My Goy Toy". She hates it :-D
Post 29 made on Saturday September 26, 2015 at 09:52
Audible Solutions
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The importance of community was brought home to me this year when my sister died in Lexington, KY. We are a small family and we all had to fly in to deal with the situation. At times like this you discover ritual and its importance to human psychology. On the one hand, the Good Christians of Lexington use their power to forbid burial on Sunday. That is the dark side of religion. Then there was the Jews of Lexington, who, living as a minority in the Bible Belt, pay attention to ritual and law but forget about ministering to human need. Another of the negatives that can befall the religious. Then there were the many in my community who paid a "shiva" call, or ritual visit to the bereaved, and you discover the importance of community.

You need to speak. You need to tell the story of the departed. But you cannot do so among the nuclear family. These are all suffering and the repetition calls the cycle of grief and pain to well up. Those visitors asking about how my sister died, sharing stories of her life all help the bereaved to pass from a state of intense grief into a dull throb of sorrow. It allows the family in grief to move back into the world. All religions have these traditions and rituals. It is these rituals and the people in the community practicing them that help individuals t deal with their trauma without which their suffering would last longer and be felt more intensely. One of the mysteries of human psychology is that pain held will show up in other behaviors.


Religion may not be healthy. Contemplation and mediation is healthy, but these are often found within religions and religious practice. One can find these benefits in transcendental meditation or even intense athletic exertion if one is lucky to experience "runner's high." Tradition, ritual and history may be more important than religious attendance or even prayer. People become joiners for all sorts of reasons, not all of them good and many of them selfish. But ritual and tradition does typically involve a wider world, whether than be ministering to the needs of others, sharing joy or sorrow with family, extended family, friends and the wider community, as well as moving one's focus from the solipsism of life toward the needs of others in our community.
YMMV
Alan
"This is a Christian Country,Charlie,founded on Christian values...when you can't put a nativiy scene in front fire house at Christmas time in Nacogdoches Township, something's gone terribly wrong"
Post 30 made on Saturday September 26, 2015 at 10:49
juliejacobson
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^ +1
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
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